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Fletch
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PostSubject: PRICES   Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:07 pm

Over the past year I have been fascinated by the price of things that are up for sale. People ask a price at the beginning which when the article is not sold, they drop, which is a sensible thing to do if you wish to sell something if the asking price is not paid in the beginning. Most people always ask what they would like at the beginning then are prepared to negotiate. Items that are used always have had a re sale value, take cars depreciation set at a % if in good condition etc, when we buy an expensive item such as a car most people surely look at whether that model etc holds its value.
Property, in Bulgaria at the moment the drop in asking prices for re sales in just unbelievable, some even being sold at half what the person paid in the beginning, I am not just talking apartments in the coastal resorts but it is now evident in village properties. I am only talking Bulgaria, which leads to me to my questions

1. Do you think that people are doing this because they are selling up and just want to get something for there property and are prepared to take a loss

2. Or that they bought items and property thinking that they would make big profits when selling these in Bulgaria, and property would be worth a lot more in a few years, so now are just trying to off load items even at a loss

3. Or are second hand items now worth nothing,

Just interested in what other people think

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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:23 pm

@Fletch wrote:
some even being sold at half what the person paid in the beginning, I am not just talking apartments in the coastal resorts but it is now evident in village properties.

In my experience, that can easily be 70% and not 50%, but generally not more, though I have come across 90% just once.

@Fletch wrote:
1. Do you think that people are doing this because they are selling up and just want to get something for there property and are prepared to take a loss

2. Or that they bought items and property thinking that they would make big profits when selling these in Bulgaria, and property would be worth a lot more in a few years, so now are just trying to off load items even at a loss

3. Or are second hand items now worth nothing,

1. Yes.

2. Yes.

3. Well, still something, but maybe not as much as had been anticipated.
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starlite
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:30 pm

i think there are many different reasons for selling up. if people have multiple properties then they bought either for hopefully a profitable return or a rental income, this is a gamble in bulgaria.
some return home due to illness and may take a loss as money seems to have no value in these times.
some did not do their financial homework and 5 years down the line their savings have gone on the cost of living here. in desperation they will take what they can get.
it all depends on individual circumstances. s
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seven
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Tue Mar 22, 2011 9:00 am

I think that the statistical data that is given in papers etc really can't be trusted here, not saying that those drops in prices aren't happening, but if you then did a comparison on the un-renovated houses that are on the market and are seriously over priced but are still being sold, then things begin to balance out.

The example I have is in my Hamlet.. one tiny property in a sweet location for sale at 27,000 euro in serious need of renovation, quick sale wanted due to medical problems with the couple, v's large property with stunning views, land and outbuildings no rush to sell, on the market for 22,000 leva!!!! Go figure.....

Until there is a nationwide standard valuation program it is going to continue to be a hit and miss affair with all statistical data being very dubious at best, as there are still more back hand deals taking place and incorrect purchase prices being put on deeds than correct ones, so no one really knows what houses are really being sold for. Hell, I even sold my house in the UK 20% below asking price on paper so the buyers could avoid stamp duty and I was then paid the rest in cash...

Theres nothing like statistics :-)
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BGTRAVELLER
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Tue Mar 22, 2011 12:57 pm

I'm of a similar opinion to starlite I do believe that a lot of people bought property to make a quick buck thinking it was going to be the next Spain or Portagal etc and a lot of this can be blamed on the hype from all the TV programs and publicity that Bulgaria received. At present I know of 19 families in Bulgaria that would sell up tomorrow if they could but as we all know the market is flooded with property at the moment and will be for the foreseeable future in my opinion. I know of 2 couples who sold up all the contents of their property and walked away from it after trying to sell for 2 years and the maintenance cost out weighed hanging onto it. With some people it will be a the case that they didn't do their homework correctly and even if they did reality is different to theory so again we see that these people get so desperate financially that they will get out at any cost even making a short term loss which can be seen by those who have walked away to start elsewhere and cutting their losses. I think over the coming years we will all see a lot more of this where people have made a mistake for 1 reason or another at the end of the day people in general will take a loss for a while but then something has to give? I feel very sorry for a lot that have made a mistake by moving to Bulgaria only to find that its not what they were led to believe and maybe they were told by friends that its a great place to live and lets not forget it is for some but its not everyones cup of tea.
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oddball
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Tue Mar 22, 2011 2:32 pm

s

Some very good points raised here. We thought we could live life in a quiet village but after a while it was clear that it was not for us, to be honest I do think the idea of owning a property abroad held a great attraction for us, the sun the holiday and the general lifestyle appealed, but in reality we did not think it through and I assume at the time, we would not have listened to anyone anyway. You can talk till the cows come home but once people have made the decision, they want to live the dream and what are dreams for, if we can't live them. Life is what it is, we all make decisions that we think are the best for us but in reality not always the case.

Our plans changed after our long visit. I know now I could not live so far away from amenities I would never stay in the place on my own and we need people around us so we can communicate with. These things we never took into consideration. Other factors are people only see us British as money, sorry to be so blunt but this is the case and it has been proven so many times, but then we don't know any different until we have been there for a while and learn how things are and mostly the people we can trust. Don't get me wrong, we have very good friends in BG but there are has been one or two chances too.

If we had only though it through and gone on a 3 month holiday we could have saved ourselves a fortune, but life is life and if I had the choice all over again I would think very carefully and know we would not buy property in Bulgaria. It's great for holidays but a whole different ball game to live there.

Oddy

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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Tue Mar 22, 2011 3:02 pm

We bought three houses in bulgaria over the last few years. I bought the first with the intention of moving there and after several years of going back and forth as much as I love it. My husband and realised we will never be able to live perminently in it as there isn't the potential for work and the village strictly upholds its residential areas so i would have great difficulty in working from home without upsetting the neighbours. So we now plan to finish renovating and rent it out.
The second I bought without seeing (big mistake!!) As it was more suitable for the purpose required. Had a lot of land and was extremely cheap. When I went to see it I knew why. The village was awful. very unKempt and the men took far too much interest in my daughter, who is autistic;
so im concerned about who she is around. They also unfortunately saw us as a walking pound note. THat house has been up for sale now for two years and I have even considered giving it away so I don't have to spend anymore money on it.
My third is perfect, researched properly and with a better idea of what i actually want to do. Can't wait to go for good. However Im not sure I would advise anyone else to buy without looking or preferably staying there for a while because there does seem to be a hugh difference in attitude from village to village. ::

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itchyfeet
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:31 pm

We have a similar situation here in Turkey, two years ago properties here in Altinkum were worth nearly double what they are valued at now. In the past, prospected purchasers were encouraged to buy more than one property in order to rent them out during the season, this very rarely materialised, but of course the agents had sold 2 or 3 properties and not just one. Deeds were often drawn up with a sale value far less than the amount paid, this enabled the agent to get their hands on more money because the purchaser had paid the full land tax on the amount paid.

The majority of sales were for new properties, so there wasn't any renovation work to be done. At the present time the property values are on the floor and costs for Exats living here has risen beyond a lot of their incomes and savings. The Turkish government have made it quite clear that they want the Brits here, but only on holidays as tourists, the feeling amongst most Brits is that if they want to live here permanently the Turkish government will make them pay through the nose for Visas and Residency Permits, the costs of which have doubled in less than 3 years.

Brits are selling up to go back to the UK or relocate somewhere else in the world. BG is very popular and El Hovo and Yambol seem to be very popular. There appears to be a mass exodus at the moment and the new cost for visas will be announced shortly. If the Turkish increase the Visas again like last year there will be a stampede for the door. Most Brits here and I guess also in BG are either retired or near retirement age and could not afford to live in the UK on their pensions, the UK are making the pensioners subsidise the rest of the benefits system and consequently a lot of us have moved somewhere else in the world to live, not just survive!!

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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Thu Mar 24, 2011 3:20 pm

@borntolaze wrote:
I'd rather take the loss now than let the house deteriate over a couple of years and then have an even bigger problem selling it.

You have to balance that against a market recovery. The crappy situation with sales isn't going to last forever.
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Thu Mar 24, 2011 6:07 pm

Pretty much everything has been covered. However, I would like to mention that it is not unreasonable to expect that a renovation to a good standard would be reflected in the asking price. Given the recession and the housing market burst bubble its probable that no-one would recover the outlay unless bought years ago. Having said that, I do think that Brits in general, still only want to pay around 10,000 euros and get a bargain. Its very unfortunate for folks who, for one reason or another, have to sell and still cannot find a buyer. There are some amazing bargains around but maybe people still think that 40000 euros for a renovated house is too expensive and that the seller is asking too much. Most people on this forum will agree that renovating is not just about money, but the hassle involved. There are not many countries in the world where you can buy a great, liveable house in a country where the cost of living is still comparatively low. Bulgarian property boom took off thanks to TV but almost immediately suffered a downturn because of the same media bad publicity because they stupidly expected an ex-communist country to become the next Spain, Greece or Italy.
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Thu Mar 24, 2011 10:36 pm

Personally we are willing to sell at a loss as I know for certain that we have no intention of moving back here once we leave, I'd rather take the loss now than let the house deteriate over a couple of years and then have an even bigger problem selling it.
I knew when I bought it that I'd never recoupe any money I spent making it a home and would have to take a loss but at the time I didn't expect to move so soon!!
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Fri Mar 25, 2011 5:49 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Personally we are willing to sell at a loss as I know for certain that we have no intention of moving back here once we leave, I'd rather take the loss now than let the house deteriate over a couple of years and then have an even bigger problem selling it.
I knew when I bought it that I'd never recoupe any money I spent making it a home and would have to take a loss but at the time I didn't expect to move so soon!!
Who's messed up the order of the posts on this thread?!
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Fri Mar 25, 2011 5:55 pm

Hi Andy we had some problems with the forum recently and all the times were wrong in fact your post was only posted today according to the original so I had to move them around . g

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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:12 pm

I did notice that the posts had been moved around but they do look better now and make more sense. T
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PostSubject: Re: PRICES   Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:57 am

We have heard a lot of people say they bought thinking they were going to make a profit in 5 years,which of course was never going to happen and probably won't happen for the next 20-30 years.There have also been a lot of people living off the sale of there UK house and of course the money doesn't last for ever,especially now prices of day to day things are increasing.Cars etc,were very expensive when we arrived here,so maybe people have realised they just have to get some money in a very saturated market.

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